Realm Creation Guide WIP

For Wizard Kings (and higher) to discuss the Realm Editor and the creation of realms.
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NoWorries
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Re: Realm Creation Guide WIP

Post by NoWorries » Wed Dec 09, 2015 10:02 pm

SpiteAndMalice wrote:The realm creation guide could be changed on the basis of the features we already have. We have a feature which allows the naming of realms as Lore or NonLore:
I didn't wholly grok what you were suggesting before you provided the visual clarification. Thank you for that.

The idea certainly does open up some possibilities. A "(Lore)" or "(NonLore)" appellation by themselves might not be a best approach, as there are criteria not directly related to Lore which I understand some wish to sidestep, too. It might be simpler to consider realms which add "(Not Moderated)" or "(Not Moderator Approved)" or "(Not Sanctioned)" or somesuch agreed label if they make no pretense to conforming to the Realm Creation guide. And this label should perhaps precede the realm name rather than append it.

In any event, realms which do not conform with Snapshot's vision for their game should be clearly labeled as not conforming so that new players to the game do confuse what they're selecting with something that Snapshot envisioned for them. And any realm without such an appellation could be considered to conform with the vision as a default. Also, such a labeling scheme would safely include the existing realms, all of which should already conform to current Realm Creation Guide standards and thereby not need a special appellation. Thus, the default would remain as it is, while some exceptions might be allowed for those who do not wish to conform to the Realm Creation Guide.

All that said, I'm not endorsing this idea. It's just something to consider.
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Farious
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Re: Realm Creation Guide WIP

Post by Farious » Wed Dec 09, 2015 10:08 pm

NoWorries wrote:
SpiteAndMalice wrote:Do you see anything there about an 18 point guideline which the player will be constrained by whilst creating those realms? Because that's where the information should be appearing.
What is a "Realm"? Generally prudent to read up on such things in associated publications (i.e., Kickstarter, official website, official forums) before spending so much on a mere game.
I personally never envisaged Realms that were pub quizzes or legally questionable parodies of blockbuster films and I honestly don't see how anyone can make that leap when buying a fantasy based game. To quote this website with regard to the intent for Realms:
The Realms of Chaos are the focus of the single-player RPG experience.
Anyhow, I don't think sacrificing namespace to indicate if a Realm is lore compliant or not is a good idea. The character limit for Realm names is quite restrictive as it is and a couple of Realm Creators have indicated they want to tell a story over multiple Realms which would require sacrificing characters for the Part number as well. If Snapshot do think having Lore & Non-lore is the way to go, then it needs to be a graphical tag imho.

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Re: Realm Creation Guide WIP

Post by SpiteAndMalice » Wed Dec 09, 2015 11:39 pm

Farious wrote: I personally never envisaged Realms that were pub quizzes or legally questionable parodies of blockbuster films and I honestly don't see how anyone can make that leap when buying a fantasy based game.
You not seeing that leap doesn't mean that that leap doesn't happen.
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Re: Realm Creation Guide WIP

Post by Al-Khwarizmi » Thu Dec 10, 2015 12:36 am

NoWorries wrote:In any event, realms which do not conform with Snapshot's vision for their game should be clearly labeled as not conforming so that new players to the game do confuse what they're selecting with something that Snapshot envisioned for them. And any realm without such an appellation could be considered to conform with the vision as a default. Also, such a labeling scheme would safely include the existing realms, all of which should already conform to current Realm Creation Guide standards and thereby not need a special appellation
I'm fine with this. In fact, my proposal some time ago was two tabs in the list: the approved realms, and the unofficial realms (maybe unofficial is not the most precise word, I'm not a native English speaker, but you get the idea I hope). The approved realms tab would be selected by default. When clicking the unofficial realms tab you would be shown a warning: "Note that unofficial realms are freely user-generated content that has not been moderated or selected for their quality. It is not guaranteed that they comply with standards of quality or are coherent with game lore. Play at your own risk".

If instead of the tabs we want a simpler implementation, it could be a column table or just a word in brackets in the name as suggested above [Unofficial], which could even be shown in red or with a yellow warning sign. Clicking the realm to play would show a dialog with the warning text above, and then the player would either confirm that they want to play, or cancel.

I think it's safe to say that something like this would be easy to implement, it would be guaranteed that no player that wants a coherent lore experience would play non-lore realms even by mistake. At the same time, it would give players wanting alternative experiences the possibility to try non-lore realms at their own risk. I think it's a win-win for everyone.
Farious wrote:I personally never envisaged Realms that were pub quizzes or legally questionable parodies of blockbuster films and I honestly don't see how anyone can make that leap when buying a fantasy based game.
Haven't played much fantasy games lately? :) Many players buy RPG's for the mods rather than for the core game, and often the mods and the core game are like chalk and cheese...

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Re: Realm Creation Guide WIP

Post by NoWorries » Thu Dec 10, 2015 1:20 am

Al-Khwarizmi wrote:I think it's safe to say that something like this would be easy to implement, it would be guaranteed that no player that wants a coherent lore experience would play non-lore realms even by mistake. At the same time, it would give players wanting alternative experiences the possibility to try non-lore realms at their own risk. I think it's a win-win for everyone.
Good points and good ideas. Though it is problematic for moderators to include interim allowances (through naming conventions) into the existing Realm Creation Guide without some clear guidance from Snapshot on the matter. Personally, I believe it would be easier and better to allow space for these variances (1) after Snapshot completes their iterations of the core Realms experience and related systems and (2) after Snapshot adds (if they do) features such have been described (i.e., visual tabs) which it would make it very difficult for players to mistakenly stumble into an unexpected experience.
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Re: Realm Creation Guide WIP

Post by Psylum » Thu Dec 10, 2015 2:02 pm

Not being concerned with the lore or story of a realm doesn't mean I don't enjoy realms that have stories. I can enjoy realms with or without stories or even bad stories. I have a problem when the story mechanics become more important then the game mechanics. Linear stories with linear paths have less strategic options. When a realm guilds me to a location in the middle of nowhere for a story tidbit that nets me a loss in score and resources. Regurgitated strategy advice that is not strategically beneficial to that realms design. The story is a non factor to the game play it shouldn't be getting priority over game play.

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Re: Realm Creation Guide WIP

Post by gary » Thu Dec 10, 2015 2:12 pm

lore.... what is it good for... absolutely *insert your own word here as long as it is in keeping with any guidelines that mean something to you*
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Re: Realm Creation Guide WIP

Post by Tess » Thu Dec 10, 2015 5:21 pm

Psylum wrote:Not being concerned with the lore or story of a realm doesn't mean I don't enjoy realms that have stories. I can enjoy realms with or without stories or even bad stories. I have a problem when the story mechanics become more important then the game mechanics. Linear stories with linear paths have less strategic options. When a realm guilds me to a location in the middle of nowhere for a story tidbit that nets me a loss in score and resources. Regurgitated strategy advice that is not strategically beneficial to that realms design. The story is a non factor to the game play it shouldn't be getting priority over game play.
+1 Worth all realm designers paying attention to this.

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Re: Realm Creation Guide WIP

Post by SpiteAndMalice » Fri Dec 11, 2015 5:19 pm

A lot of the discussion raised so far in the thread relate to the guideline regarding lore. But many other guidelines are restrictive of creativity.

Maps can not contain geometric shapes. How does this even make sense? You've got wizards who can summon dragons from another realm, but they can't make a straight line of trees?
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Re: Realm Creation Guide WIP

Post by NoWorries » Fri Dec 11, 2015 5:54 pm

SpiteAndMalice wrote:Maps can not contain geometric shapes. How does this even make sense?
Single-wide landmasses shaped to look like smiley faces and the like? That does not fit into the universe of Chaos Reborn.
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