Realms 2.0 (A Strategic Future...)

For Wizard Kings (and higher) to discuss the Realm Editor and the creation of realms.
Sun Sep 25, 2016 4:31 pm

  • Here are my thoughts on how to do a Strategic Realms 2.0. I did one for RPG Realms 2.0, which I would prefer over Strategy but I would be happy playing Strategy.

    The game I would hope for...

    Firstly, fixed mechanics such as the Banish Spell, Reinforcement Points and Time are all customisable, and the Realm entrance fee is abolished along with Kudos points. Encounters are simplified with ‘Rewards’ removed and their role in telling a story gone – they now just for passing on information. Gold & score etc are purely calculated based upon a Realm’s Difficulty.

    Map
    The Designer places the terrain and infrastructure pretty much as they do now but now we have a more componentised approach in places.

    Realm Difficulty
    The Designer sets the initial Realm Difficulty however every time a player completes a Realm the difficulty increases by +1. Reinforcement Rate, Mana Flux Points etc are now all influenced by the Realm Difficulty setting and the setting is uncapped.

    Cosmic Balance
    A Realm can be designated as Chaos, Neutral/Natural, Law or None. If Chaos or Law then the Realm Difficulty tilts the Cosmic Balance in that direction at the start of every battle. If Neutral, then the Casting Boost/Mana Cost of Neutral Spells is affected beneficially.

    Believer Points
    A new points system that represents how much of the population a player has converted to ‘their side’ (See Towns). Players ‘found’ & name their belief systems depending upon their social rank. For example:
    • Lords can found a Follower of X and have a 1% chance of Converting 1 People to their cause.
    • Kings can found a Legend of X and have a 5% chance of Converting 1 People to their cause.
    • Demigods can found an Order of X and have a 10% chance of Converting 1 People to their cause.
    • Gods can found a Pantheon of X and have a 25% chance of Converting 1 People to their cause.

    Upon completion of a Realm the Player can choose to allocate the number of converts they amassed to one of the belief systems they founded. When a belief system reaches a certain level of followers Realm Karma is awarded (more for higher ranking belief systems but with each award the number of converts required increases for the next Karma reward). The 'popularity' of each belief system is also displayed upon a Player’s profile but this is not a persistent Realm affect - i.e. it only a cumulative score and does not impact other players in the same Realm. Realm Karma can be used to buy new ‘Belief Cosmetics’ such as Banners, Totems, and non-combat Creatures (golems?) baring portable Shrines that a player can choose to deploy on a battle map or not.

    Citadels
    The number is uncapped and these become proper command and control posts with a two stage fight, outside & inside. Outside the Designer can designate a number of Spell Totems each with a Spell Deck and a range attack capability similar to a Bolt Tower. The Realm Difficulty influences the size of the Spell Deck. Inside the Player can designate the number of enemy Wizard Lords present. A captured Citadel transfers the Wizard Kings Reinforcements Points to the Player who now also has a Reinforcements Points Pool that are used to hire Villagers instead of Kudos. Villagers sent to a Captured Citadel can be sent on again to any tile on the current land mass.

    Fog of war
    Although the explored map is shown, dimmed, Marauders and Wizard Lords aren’t unless in the players LOS which is not unlimited.

    Mana Fluxes
    Operate as they do now, except the number is again uncapped, and when a player achieves control of a majority of Mana Fluxes the Banish Spell actually goes into reverse.

    Mercs, Reputation, and Merc Slots
    Reputation is gone and Merc Slots are now unlocked by spending Realm Karma. A Merc is then created by casting a Realm Spell, say Summon Mercenary.

    Palace
    As now but it is now a 2 stage fight. Outside is similar to a Citadel but with additional Spell Totems plus a Wizard Lord. Inside is the Wizard King plus one or more Wizard Lords. Again, all configurable by the Designer. Upon victory the player may loot the Palace, receiving the Bodygear, Staff, and Talismans worn by the defeated Wizard King (See Piracy below).

    Towns
    Towns are now componentised between different types of residential graphics to reflect their populations wealth and social standing. A Wizard Lord or higher can attempt to convert the people to their Belief System by casting a special Realm Spell, Convert Disbeliever (for example). There are 3 types of residential property each taking up a map tile and each containing 10 Mortals; Slums, Town Houses, & Gentry Homes. A battle which takes place in Residential Map Tile risks killing the Mortals who are present on the Battle Map. Upon completion of a Realm the player receives a tribute/tithe from each convert in the form gold; 1 per slum dweller, 2 per converted town folk, and 5 per converted gentry. The portion of each type is of residence that can be placed is linked to the Realm Difficulty.

    Villages
    Operate as they do now except Reinforcement Points are used by the player to hire them. Again, number of fighters etc available should be customisable by the Designer. Villagers sent to a Citadel can be sent on to anywhere on the current land mass.

    Piracy
    A player leaving a Realm with loot risks being attacked by another wizard upon return to Limbo. If they have invaders switched on this will be a human player if available. If the player loses then they must select one item from their ‘on person’ inventory to secede to the winning player.

    Anyway, those are my current thoughts on Strategy. I’d prefer RPG but I wouldn’t mind playing the above at all, nor designing such Realms.

    Farious
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  • Although the ideas are interesting, though i can't really picture how they'd be implimented. Transferring current realm systems and created realm already in place, etc.

    I like the concept of the believer points though. I can this replacing the highscore system in ways. You base a score on how many villages your recruit or manage to convert to your side. Could be a good incentive to replay and experiment with how you tackle a realm. The order in which you kill lords and recruit villages (perhaps townspeople like in your idea) and how you spend it could possibly play a big part in it, this + time management could be a fun score system.

    Also the idea of dropping shrines and other things on realms for other players to find and tamper with could be good fun. whether it be on a particular lord/village battle field or something you see on the strategic layer that initiates some sort of fight with the a stand in AI with stuff like totems/creature guards that they may have placed along side the shrine.

    i'm sort of butchering your idea, but it just fascinated me.

    I personally like the idea of a more simplified realm mechanics that just open up to more interesting battles, though adding a spiffy little meta game, that could possibly tie in with demigods/gods in a clever way. Having factions run around the varying realms leaving there marks on them in their own ways.

    The pirate invader fellow could be neat to, reward the players who are logged in and intentive the chance to invade players for their booty. Could also be based on the score you have in a realm (those with higher scores get priority to invade other players for example)
    anjovi
     
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  • anjovi wrote:Although the ideas are interesting, though i can't really picture how they'd be implimented. Transferring current realm systems and created realm already in place, etc.


    You'd just leave the currently created Realms as is but don't allow any new ones to be create and just let them expire. As for the mechanics, the only new asset that would need to be created are the Town sections and Mortals. The Mortals don't in reality need to be on the map - it could be done with a formula, like the more Spells cast the greater the chance of a Mortal dying.

    anjovi wrote:I like the concept of the believer points though. I can this replacing the highscore system in ways. You base a score on how many villages your recruit or manage to convert to your side. Could be a good incentive to replay and experiment with how you tackle a realm. The order in which you kill lords and recruit villages (perhaps townspeople like in your idea) and how you spend it could possibly play a big part in it, this + time management could be a fun score system.


    Yeah.

    anjovi wrote:Also the idea of dropping shrines and other things on realms for other players to find and tamper with could be good fun.


    By doing it this way, rather than in an actual Realm and in a persistent manner it would prevent groups of players being able to specifically target another.

    anjovi wrote:i'm sort of butchering your idea, but it just fascinated me.

    Feel free :)

    anjovi wrote:I personally like the idea of a more simplified realm mechanics that just open up to more interesting battles,

    Well you know my view, Lords of Chaos 2.0 is what I want :) . But I can more than live with simplified mechanics focused around strategy. Realms needs to be either RPG or Strategic, I think we both agree on that as the hybrid just isn't working except maybe at Level 1-3. Basically, we need to dump the Story Telling or embrace it 100%.

    anjovi wrote:though adding a spiffy little meta game, that could possibly tie in with demigods/gods in a clever way. Having factions run around the varying realms leaving there marks on them in their own ways.

    'Pay-to-win.' It's a game killer imho.

    anjovi wrote:The pirate invader fellow could be neat to, reward the players who are logged in and intentive the chance to invade players for their booty. Could also be based on the score you have in a realm (those with higher scores get priority to invade other players for example)


    No sure about the score thing, but I must confess I do love the Pirate idea (I also proposed it for RPG Realms 2.0). I gives people an instant potential gratification and more reason to press the Invade but because lets face it; in a 'normal' Realm battle the Invader is probably going to lose.

    Farious
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  • The pay 2 win thing is not neccesarily pay to win. I didn't really extrapolate much on it though, so i'll try to clarify.

    An idea could include:

    Guild Faction:
    -1 god
    -followers of lower rank

    -Shrines,Totems,etc. that you could purchase and leave in any realm for ' guild influence' over that realm.
    -A means to purchase said items with gold/karma

    Over time points could accumulate and if players come across them while exploring a realm they could have the option to attack said shrine and claim that territory for their guild/god.

    A meta game of having guilds gain prominence over realms that kings create could be an interesting meta game to have players enter and interact with realms in different ways. You could ignore all of this as optional stuff or you can choose to engage with it. Shrines could be placed at certain points in realms or be hidden in some pockets of mountains or something were creators haven't placed any encounters. Perhaps random town rumors could include locations of shrines that players place.

    might be interesting seeing something like this, and having a pvp/ranked equivilent for those players to pitch into their associated guilds.
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  • anjovi wrote:The pay 2 win thing is not neccesarily pay to win. I didn't really extrapolate much on it though, so i'll try to clarify.


    The implementation some gods expect involves gods giving blessing, powers, to people they like & being able to block players becoming gods they don't like (regardless of how good the actual player is at the game). Hence, pay to win. But Orders battling for control as part of a proper strategy game & not a childish popularity contest I would in theory have no objection to. But again, the current iteration of Realms would have to be dumped.

    Hows does this sound?
    Encounters are binned for fixed assets & mechanics. Realms become proper 'worlds' designed by Kings+ and function as such. I'm thinking 'Sim City-lite' here from that point of view. Demigod+ players can 'capture' a Realm by converting its population. They do this by actually playing the game; i.e. when playing the Realm they can cast a spell for instance, like I indicated above, to 'Convert Disbeliever(s)' to their belief system. After X amount of people are converted the player can build a totem, shrine, or temple and this achievement is marked for all to see on the Realm list and other players can view an image showing all their achievements. Time in the Fractured Worlds is non-linear so this would work from a Lore perspective - every player could have an Order and every player could capture every Realm in the game without affecting other people's games. There could be a score table of top Orders.

    This 'Sim CIty-lite' type worlds could also open up the opportunity to add Realm specific functions, such as trade routes, goods trading etc between Realms & Limbo. Also a player could designate a specific Realm as their 'home' and here they place special cosmetics they can purchase with Karma and/or gold, such as designing their own Palace etc. Again, I would be happy playing this game.

    How does that sound?

    Farious

    Edit: Personally I don't want it to happen but I'm beginning to think the 'story telling' aspect of Realms has to go if the game is to have a future and it be replaced with fixed missions/victory conditions, if anything, that are defined by Snapshot.
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  • I don't think that'd be necessary.

    I'm actually pretty confident that if you were able to pace the game a bit more, with simple additions like:
    -Add reinforcement pts to lord (encounter outcome)
    -removing outcome limitations (kudos - 100, banishing at 100, etc.) for more flexibility
    -ability to add additional lords, some who aren't connected to reinforcements (and i'll plug creature squads..hehe)
    -Some sort of alchemist report journal that a player could write a message that players could refer to (for objectives they make)
    -perhaps an encounter outcome that allows you to add pages to the said journal (for unlocked objectives you find)

    I think you'd have more then enough to fine tune some interesting realms.

    i personally feel like the time limit/management aspect of realms has been underutilized by designers (even the ones created for offline mode) and at least in my testing could provide some pretty fun times, having objectives that reduce banishment rate, coordinating which places i should visit first, should i recruit this village before activating that kudos trap?, etc.

    although the whole thing of whether this lord has 0 or 3 reinforcements usually isn't enough of a deal on it's own to warrant "village politics" or whatever you'd call it hehe..It's funny because i'm really warming up to the villager dynamic say:

    I combine a manticore village with an elf village = i get the units of both villages + their cards
    their both tier 1 and i attack a lord

    The following match is actually fairly interesting, i played against an invader in law mode and the resulting match up was actually quite dynamic.

    The problem is when you attack with villagers + your wizard, then it just becomes OP and just click dragging a wave of units with no strategy....though you can mitigate this with the time pressure...if i've got 70 days left i'm less likely to waste 12 + 25 for village upgrade to max them out for a single lord fight, i might save up for 1 or 2 mantis from the village with the reassurance that i'll get more mantis if i die....though designers haven't utilized this much (reasonable, as i'm having a hard time working it out myself after all this time xD)

    I think if there was more of a way to bring this time pressure aspect out in the game (more leeway with design tools, perhaps guides to help realm designers how to make the most of it) you could have for some really fun times.
    anjovi
     
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  • anjovi wrote:I don't think that'd be necessary.

    I'm actually pretty confident that if you were able to pace the game a bit more, with simple additions like:
    -Add reinforcement pts to lord (encounter outcome)
    -removing outcome limitations (kudos - 100, banishing at 100, etc.) for more flexibility
    -ability to add additional lords, some who aren't connected to reinforcements (and i'll plug creature squads..hehe)
    -perhaps an encounter outcome that allows you to add pages to the said journal (for unlocked objectives you find)


    All of which is requested in the Wishlist, more or less. :)

    anjovi wrote:-Some sort of alchemist report journal that a player could write a message that players could refer to (for objectives they make)

    Might be an idea to suggest that in the other Wishlist thread. I think though if Designers got a Mission/Objective Log it would basically stop Players (like me :) ) forgetting what they are meant to be doing (I make enough notes as Moderator XD ).

    anjovi wrote:i personally feel like the time limit/management aspect of realms has been underutilized by designers (even the ones created for offline mode) and at least in my testing could provide some pretty fun times, having objectives that reduce banishment rate, coordinating which places i should visit first, should i recruit this village before activating that kudos trap?, etc.

    Perhaps... but I'd be happy if we could just have the option to turn off the Banish Spell or set the rate Mana Fluxes add to it & uncap the number of Mana Fluxes. Anyway Time management wise how does this sound for an approach?:-
    Encounter Outcome: Countdown Days a, b. Where a is the name of a Flag and b is the number of days. When number of days b reaches zero Flag a is set to True. That way you can create missions such as get to Realm Map coords x, y in X number of days or safely escort Merc X to Realm Map coords x, y in X number of days. I'd personally prefer something like that rather than the sledge hammer of manipulating the Banish Spell.

    anjovi wrote:The problem is when you attack with villagers + your wizard, then it just becomes OP

    Personally if we could just set Kudos costs and number of Villagers provided it would actually probably solve this and give value to collecting Kudos and stop, essentially, Villages being relegated to cosmetic landmarks in higher level Realms.

    anjovi wrote:I think if there was more of a way to bring this time pressure aspect out in the game (more leeway with design tools, perhaps guides to help realm designers how to make the most of it) you could have for some really fun times.

    Done right I think Time pressure could be great, but I'd prefer it as I have outlined above. But again, it all comes down the restrictions placed on Designers though hopefully now the Social Rank system has been replaced the Realm Editor's restrictions will be removed too (since that is why they were essentially put in originally - to slow people down becoming Demigods & Gods).
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